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NDanecker

SRW to DRW swap

Hey guys.  Just joined.  Excellent site......with a huge amount of info.  Can't believe how much I've learned so far.  Thanks!

When I purchased my truck is was for pleasure.  Then I purchased a 40' GN for my tractor and toys and decided I need a dually.  I then did a dually swap (which I now regret doing as I just should have sold and purchased dually) where I purchased a DRW axle from junk yard, purchased 19.5 tires, etc.

I tried getting the MFG sticker to upgrade my GVW and/or axle rating to show this upgrade but no one will touch it, which is understandable considering the possible legal issues if an accident would occur.

I've been reading about Hotshotting for way over a year now.  I have my CDL A, hazmat, air, tandems, etc. and would like to give it a shot (no pun intended).  LOL

Q:  Do you think I could get by with the upgraded axle and tires alone, or would I still be held to the 6000# rear axle rating, never mind the 9000# GVW rating, which from reading a few threads are only a manufacturer recommened vehicle max weight anyway?

I would prefer to give it a try with my current truck then go buy new.  I also like my 5.9 over a new 6.7.  I am willing to remove the bed and turn the truck into a fake chassis truck to save some weight and avoid the 65' limit.  If things go well then I'd invest in a new Dodge 4500 (or 5500).

Thanks guys!!!

EDIT:  My truck is 04.5 Dodge 2500 with nv5600, 600 motor, quad cab LWB.
Brisco

You'll get better answers from others over this than from me.

I'm only posting because I want to see pictures of this conversion.

Got any??  :D
Gary

I'd highly advise againt doing a swap. The DOT will go off the door sticker.
NDanecker

Really don't have many pics during the conversion but here are a few.

Before the conversion



After the conversion.





Difference between SRW and DRW Axle (DRW about 3" wider).





Here is a pic picking up a machine (personal use).

G4 Trucking

nice truck man  
NDanecker

Gary wrote:
I'd highly advise againt doing a swap. The DOT will go off the door sticker.


That is what I'm thinking also.

I was told from other people commenting (but they weren't really 'in the businees' thus why I asked the question here) that if you look like a duck & quack like a duck its probably a duck (3500 dually) and they won't look at the door tag.

But again - if you get into an accident and its weight related be ready to lose it all.

Does DOT really look at the door tag when stopped?  I've read many posts on here that they simply check for paperwork (dot, ifta, registered to proper weight, cdl, etc.) and have a good feeling of what's legal for a stock 3500 dually.

Like I said, I was just looking to get started and once I get my feet wet I'd make the jump and purchase a new 4500.
G4 Trucking

still have your fender flares?
NDanecker

G4 Trucking wrote:
still have your fender flares?


Gave them to my brother for his 3500 SRW.  I could ask him if he's going to use them or not and interested in getting rid of them.

They were nice, but I really didn't like them.  They were screwed in under the fender but held with 3M tape on the outside of the fender.  The tape always worked its way lose and although they couldn't fall off it would vibrate and rub the paint away between backside of flare and outside of fender.
G4 Trucking

in thant case maybe it's not a good idea, I would like a pair for the front of my truck, I just sold my bed  so I would like 2 but not if they rub my paint off
Gary

NDanecker wrote:
Gary wrote:
I'd highly advise againt doing a swap. The DOT will go off the door sticker.


That is what I'm thinking also.

I was told from other people commenting (but they weren't really 'in the businees' thus why I asked the question here) that if you look like a duck & quack like a duck its probably a duck (3500 dually) and they won't look at the door tag.

But again - if you get into an accident and its weight related be ready to lose it all.

Does DOT really look at the door tag when stopped?  I've read many posts on here that they simply check for paperwork (dot, ifta, registered to proper weight, cdl, etc.) and have a good feeling of what's legal for a stock 3500 dually.

Like I said, I was just looking to get started and once I get my feet wet I'd make the jump and purchase a new 4500.



Yes some of the guys have had the DOT open their doors and look at stickers. We never go over our axle GVW's.

Nice looking truck.
mbeal

Nice work putting  this puppy together...
NDanecker

Thanks guys!

hey - I just read on another thread where a guy re-rated his truck by M&H Truck and Auto, or some name like that.

Does anyone know where I can re-rate the GVW of the axles/truck?

I spend a lot of time investigating this for a place here in NJ.  Never thought of going out of state.  I'd be willing to travel if someone would be willing to inspect the work and verify the swap.

This would at least get me legal for a few months for testing the waters and then go to a full 4500/5500 Dodge later on.

Thansk!
mbeal

This is like a show truck.  "IF"  you can get  it rerated by an third party and it works I would love to be the one running it up and down the road.

Found this on Google:

M H Truck & Auto Svc
2365 Camp Swatara Rd
Myerstown, Pennsylvania 17067
Phone: (717) 933-5733

Not far from you and said "ratings' in their add.  Might be worth making the call and let us know...
NDanecker

mbeal wrote:
This is like a show truck.  "IF"  you can get  it rerated by an third party and it works I would love to be the one running it up and down the road.

Found this on Google:

M H Truck & Auto Svc
2365 Camp Swatara Rd
Myerstown, Pennsylvania 17067
Phone: (717) 933-5733

Not far from you and said "ratings' in their add.  Might be worth making the call and let us know...


WOW!  Thanks for the info.  Will call tomorrow and/or Monday and let you know what I come up with.  I read someone else here asked about SRW-DRW conversion so I'm not the only crazy one that did this!?!??!  

I really should buy another truck but can't afford or justify it now unless I know this is for me.
buster

If anyone is interested I have a complete dually convertion kit for dodge for sale including michelin tires and aluminum wheels.  Send me a P.M. if interested. The kit was made by Arrowcraft.

http://www.arrowcraft.com/








NDanecker

mbeal wrote:
This is like a show truck.  "IF"  you can get  it rerated by an third party and it works I would love to be the one running it up and down the road.

Found this on Google:

M H Truck & Auto Svc
2365 Camp Swatara Rd
Myerstown, Pennsylvania 17067
Phone: (717) 933-5733

Not far from you and said "ratings' in their add.  Might be worth making the call and let us know...


I must have called 15 times today each time the number was busy.  Finally just got through and it was a residence.  Seems they closed down some time ago.

tbt70

srw to drw

hey guy's got a long time freind who is ohio dot he said they don't look on a normal stop , unless your over weight to start with then it's out with the tape and the nine yard's
NDanecker

Re: srw to drw

tbt70 wrote:
hey guy's got a long time freind who is ohio dot he said they don't look on a normal stop , unless your over weight to start with then it's out with the tape and the nine yard's


When you say 'over weight' do you mean when you go over your registered weight?  Can't they bring that up quickly just by scanning your front/rear plate before you get to the scales?
fullforce

I hate to bring this back up, but whats from stoping someone from getting the door sticker off a dually?
If you actually do the axle conversion and you know in your head that your suspension and brakes and axle ratings have been upgraded then I dont see why not?
Only reason I even pulled this up is because I can find some SRW 2500/3500's for alot less than a DRW and in much better shape, chances are they havent towed as much also..
Walkinman

To the best of my knowledge the axle weight ratings on your door sticker are recommendations, not law.  I wouldn't say it's a good idea to exceed them but if you do I don't believe they can write you a ticket for it.  Tire weight ratings are a different story as those are actually issued by the DOT.  I believe Canada is different than the US but given that I don't run up there I'm hardly an authority on the subject...
cyyngblood

Does This Address the Issue at Hand?

Two questions with answers copied for review|

Question 3: If a vehicle’s Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) plate and/or VIN number are missing but its actual gross weight is 26,001 pounds or more, may an enforcement officer use the latter instead of GVWR to determine the applicability of the Part 383?

Guidance: Yes. The only apparent reason to remove the manufacturer’s Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) plate or VIN number is to make it impossible for roadside enforcement officers to determine the applicability of part 383, which has a GVWR threshold of 26,001 pounds. In order to frustrate willful evasion of safety regulations, an officer may therefore presume that a vehicle which does not have a manufacturer’s GVWR plate and/or does not have a VIN number has a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more if: (1) It has a size and configuration normally associated with vehicles that have a GVWR of 26,001 pounds or more; and (2) It has an actual gross weight of 26,001 pounds or more.

A motor carrier or driver may rebut the presumption by providing the enforcement officer the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) plate, the VIN number or other information of comparable reliability which demonstrates, or allows the officer to determine, that the GVWR of the vehicle is below the jurisdictional weight threshold.

                     Question 4 seems the most applicable!

Question 4: If a vehicle with a manufacturer’s Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) of less than 26,001 pounds has been structurally modified to carry a heavier load, may an enforcement officer use the higher actual gross weight of the vehicle, instead of the GVWR, to determine the applicability of part 383?

Guidance: Yes. The motor carrier’s intent to increase the weight rating is shown by the structural modifications. When the vehicle is used to perform functions normally performed by a vehicle with a higher Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR), §390.33 allows an enforcement officer to treat the actual gross weight as the GVWR of the modified vehicle.
fullforce

hmmm were did this information come from?
cyyngblood

Straight from the horse's mouth! FMSCA.DOT.GOV/rules.
Interpretation for 383.5.

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-re...;guidence=y&keyword=air%20bag


 
fullforce

So I guess you dont even have to remove te door tag, just have the upgraded equipment and your ok? Sounds to easy
glassrunner

First off  FMCSA only recognizes a modified vehicle that has been recertifed by a qualified person. As the OP found out a certified vehicle alterer/modifier won't touch it. He or we don't qualifiy as a certified person.
  See 49 CFR 595 make inoperative exemptions and;
Frequently Asked Questions
on the Exemptions to the
Make Inoperative Prohibition
For some reason my browser won't accept this webs URL clicky linky thing so if anyone interested a google may be required..
If the vehicle has been legally altered and recertified by a qualified person then 393 may comply. Also see your state for registering a altered vehicle. I doub't their on the same page.

Also removing a tag from a vehicle to be junked and affixed to anther vehicle or altering or removing  a vin tag or a certifiaction tag in my state is a misdemeanor.

The trucks axle rating on the certification placard are enforceable. A TX size and weight officer wrote me out a compell to redistribute form for being over my 3500 DRW rear axle capacity. I had LT235/85-16 E on the truck but he says its the lessor of the tires or the vehicle axle rating.
 
 Luckily I was hauling wheeled equipment on my bigger flatdeck so I simply mover the loader on the back of the trailer farther aft till the truck came within 5 percent allowance of the axle ratings.  I was well under gross combined so no issues there.
mr.mindless

glassrunner wrote:

The trucks axle rating on the certification placard are enforceable. A TX size and weight officer wrote me out a compell to redistribute form for being over my 3500 DRW rear axle capacity. I had LT235/85-16 E on the truck but he says its the lessor of the tires or the vehicle axle rating.


Since you were able to redistrubute your load (good thing!), I don't suppose you got any paperwork that cited the statute backing that statement?

I see so many commercially operated one tons - they almost all have beds, and some are Chevys, so they're surely not 4500 or 5500 trucks - pulling 3 and 4 car wedges on the Thruway here, and I know I can't have my wedge full without being 8300-8500# on my rear axle. Dodge only rates it at 7500 even though Dana rates the 80 at 11,000, and I have almost 14,000 pounds of tires on it so I'm not going to feel bad, it just makes me wonder.

I don't know where these guys operate, maybe it's just a matter of under the radar since scales are so few and far between here in the East.
fullforce

this is getting way to confusing!

Looks like I just need to find a good dually..
Ive even seen 3 car wedges on SRW trucks, although that has nothing to do with this....

I guess I just need to get a dually and be done with it, its just a little scary throwing $20,000 out there for a truck that already has 100,000+ miles on it. When I could get a 2500/3500 SRW with less than 100K for around 15K that hasnt even had a gooskneck ball installed in it!.... ill keep looking
Walkinman

I would also like to see the statute behind that.  It's not that I doubt you in any way, I would just like to confirm or deny the validity of what the officer told you.  It's a shame that so many of the rules we have to abide by are written in such a way that it's open to interpretation rather than just being a black and white issue.  I've had my door tag checked numerous times when I've been over the rating issued, then they proceeded to go check my tires, compare the ratings to my scaled weight and they move on without ever saying a word... Maybe I just keep getting lucky?

Either way though now with the CSA 2010 program and the fact that any ticket issued is automatically on your record with virtually no recourse it makes me really nervous.  It doesn't matter if it's a bs ticket or not, you can fight it, have it thrown out, and it still stays on your safestat record unless you do a data-Q challenge and convince the officer to remove it.  Like that's likely to happen!!    Innocent until proven guilty?  I don't think so.
Hogstroker

Very interesting. So when the vehicle total gross weight rating is less than the the 2 axles combined and below Registered total gross?
glassrunner

I'm not from TX but the code the officer gave me  was TX 621.404 which says;
Sec. 621.404.
   UNLOADING VEHICLE IF AXLE WEIGHT EXCEEDED.  (a)  If the axle weight of a motor vehicle weighed under Section 621.402 is heavier than the maximum axle weight authorized by law for the vehicle plus a tolerance allowance equal to five percent of that maximum weight, the weight enforcement officer shall require the operator or owner of the vehicle to rearrange the vehicle's cargo, if possible, to bring the vehicle's axles within the maximum axle weight allowed by law for that vehicle.  If the requirement cannot be satisfied by rearrangement of cargo, a part of the vehicle's load shall be unloaded to decrease the axle weight to a weight that is not heavier than the maximum axle weight allowed by law for the vehicle plus the applicable tolerance allowance.(b)  The vehicle may not be operated further over the public highways or roads of the state until the axle weight of the vehicle has been reduced as required by Subsection (a).
Acts 1995, 74th Leg., ch. 165, Sec. 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1995.  Amended by Acts 2001, 77th Leg., ch. 941, Sec. 21, eff. Sept. 1, 2001.

There was no overload violation after I redistributed so no ticket/paper work was issued. Yeah I was lucky.

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